Kashmiri Nomad has an excelent write up. Do check it out. Especially for those who think westerners are tolerant
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You’re currently reading “Myth of Western Tolerance,” an entry on Mental Vomits
10.19.06 / 7am
Dear Nazim,
Hope you keeping well. Well I read the full post; to be honest it’s sad that she has suffered so much. But I don’t agree with point Myth of Western Tolerance. Westerner are tolerant believe me or not. I do accept there are people racist people who always do these sort of things but it doesn’t mean whole of Europe support this. Some racist people just taunts or will say some thing abusive to any brown skin people they will see (Muslim or Non Muslim). Now a days these sort of news coming more because of so called War with Islam. Like now a day’s hot topic is “Veil”. People in other world thinks that it’s only westerner or non Islamic are against of “Veil” nope their many Muslims people are also against the “Veil” things that one and very basic reason all westerner thinks that “Veil” is the symbol of separatism. Check this report
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,1072-2394934,00.html#post_comment
We are going through very hard times; we had lost more life in the name of religion than in proper war. No idea when it will stop if ever.
10.19.06 / 8am
I think that westerners r far more tolerant(comparitively).In India riots took a significant toll after 58 hindus were burned alive allegedly by a muslim mob in Gujrat.Riots took place in Pakistan and Bangladesh after destruction of Babri Masjid in India.Just yesterday riots took place agianst tamilians in Colombo as LTTE destroted a Sri Lankan Naval Base which killed 105 people.
However Did Americans go on a rampage after 3000 people were killed in 7/11 attacks by a muslim group?
Did Britishers go on a rampage after 60 people were killed by british born muslims ?
The answer is NO.No rioting took place.Can u expect the same result if 3000 hindus r killed by muslims in India or vice versa in Pakistan?
YES…BY ALL MEANS WESTERNERS ARE FAR MORE TOLERANT THAN US.
10.19.06 / 10am
The point of the post was not to compare “western” tolerance with Kashmiri tolerance or Indian tolerance or Pakistani tolerance. When making comparsions one must remember to compare like with like. For the most part the three places that I named in South Asia I do not think can be compared with a place like Britain. This because of the obvious political, economical, social and historical reasons.
Western socties whether they be American or British or French pander to a self-image that likes to feel good about themselves as being tolerant and civil socities. However some of the policies and demonisation of these states especially towards Muslims do not match this. Herein lies the problem, namely that of hipocracy and not of comparison.
10.19.06 / 11am
Whether bcos of political,social or economic reason..the point is they r more tolerant than us.It is very well demonstrated by US n UK public reaction to 7/11 and 9/11 attacks.It may have brought out dislike againsty muslims…but certainly didnot lead to killing or burning.
The word Tolerance is not an isolated word.It has to be always seen in comparision.
10.19.06 / 9pm
However Did Americans go on a rampage after 3000 people were killed in 7/11 attacks by a muslim group?
Are you kidding? Where were you when the Americans ‘went on a rampage’ and bombed the crap out of Afghanistan? Where were you when they then ‘went on a rampage’ and bombed Iraq? Did you miss all that?
10.19.06 / 11pm
@Kashmiri Nomad
You are 100% correct brother. These guys are blowing the trumpet of tolerance. Where did that tolerance go when America and UK raided Afghanistan and killed thousands of innocent people in the name of war on terror and for the sake of one man. Even if US was looking for Osama, it can not be justified to kill thousands in search of one. Same thing happened in case of Iraq. Where are those WMDs.
See what has America done to those countries, hundreds of thousands dead. Even if those people were under so called opperesion at least they were not dying at this rate. At least they were peaceful comparatively.
@abishek
Dud you are always short of facts. Please go back to your history books and keep an eye on BBC, CNN etc.
10.23.06 / 7pm
Kashmiri Nomad’s Western tolerance talked about internal tolernace.Pls learn to differentiate between internal riots n external war.If Indian/Pakistani army went on a rampage in Islamabd/delhi ..it would be temred as war not communal genocide or riot.Pls answer in context.
10.23.06 / 11pm
@abishek
Dear abishek, what you are saying is 100% correct. But these hate attacks have started after these to two wars. I mean Taliban was still there before and Sadam as well. In fact, it was US who established Taliban and Osama. Did they not knew at that time that Taliban were so called hard core “ISLAMOFACISTS”. Or it was fine till that was done to USSR.
You are right these are internal riots not war. But still the point holds that they are traumatizing muslims.
Now do not go over that 9/11 and 7/7 thingie again and say it was muslims who started that. Go back to your history books. Read the histroy of last one thousand years and you will come to know who started all this thing.
10.28.06 / 10am
Sorry..i m quite busy nowdays.
Of course such hate attacks only took place after these two wars.But the point is(which u r missing)..that it didnot led to killing,burning,persecution of muslims in these western countries.
YOU SAID” But still the point holds that they are traumatizing muslims. ”
Again!!!!!A political state is responsible for the safety n security of its political citizens irrespective of caste,creed,color or religion.And US/UK or other western countries have done it very well.Iraqi,Afgani r not its political citizens.The safety of Afgni n Iraqi lies upon its own govt…which they failed.
Tommorrow if India captures pakistan..it would be failure on part of pakistan.It cannot be called as traumatizing the muslims.India’s responsibility ends with assuring he safety of Indian muslims not pakistanii .It is applicable for every nation.
10.28.06 / 10am
You said”Go back to your history books. Read the histroy of last one thousand years and you will come to know who started all this thing.
”
Yes I have done so.Pls enlighten me about Hindukush mountains,gauri,Ghaznawi.
Again ..u r more interested in who started it…so is Osama Bin Laden taking revenge for those who started it??.
11.1.06 / 6pm
@abhisek
A political state is responsible for the safety n security of its political citizens irrespective of caste,creed,color or religion.And US/UK or other western countries have done it very well.Iraqi,Afgani r not its political citizens.The safety of Afgni n Iraqi lies upon its own govt…which they failed.
So you agree that NATO forces are not protecting Iraqis/Afganis as they claim to be. GOOD. At last you have shown some maturity.
Tommorrow if India captures pakistan….
Wish full thinking. 
Pls enlighten me about Hindukush mountains,gauri,Ghaznawi.
Point # 1) These were not religious wars. We are talking about religious wars.
Anyways, These were political wars fought to expand the respective empires. Which everyone in the world was doing at that time. India would have also done that but the problem was too many small kingdoms and continuous conflicts between them within India, which actually gave less time to think of expansion beyond Indian subcontinent. Talk about wars/battles which different maharajas were involved within Indian subcontinent. If Ashoka expands his empire, he is Ashora, The Great. If muslim does so……..
u r more interested in who started it…so is Osama Bin Laden taking revenge for those who started it??
Revenge is the wrong word. Osama want US people to vacate Saudi Arabia. This is war, as you already said and it is strategy. If NATO has rights to poke its nose in every muslim affair and plunder and kill, don’t others have the same right.
BTW, there are people who have come up with theories that it was Bush who did 9/11. There is still no clear cut evidence that Osama was behind 9/11.
11.1.06 / 8pm
OK AGREED.Gauri Ghaznamwi were political wars.Then in the same manner USA war on Iraq n Saudi r political n economic ones..for oil.SO obviously people getting killed in Iraq r the result of a political war…so it must be as justified as gauri n ghaznawi did by killing hordes of hindus in India.isnot it??
11.1.06 / 8pm
@abhisek
Fine, great! Alhamdulillah! Thats what i have been saying all the time. These wars are only for Oil and nothing else. But why are these political wars wrapped up as idealogical wars and war on terror. There is Jihad declared by Somalia on Ethipia. Why is not NATO sending forces there to root out terrorists. Because if Muslims kill muslims, its not terrorism. Why did NATO support freedom of East Timor. Because it was Christians who were asking for freedom. Why do they want Darfur(south Sudan) to be liberated. Because it is christians who are asking for freedom. If a Muslim asks for freedom, he is a FUCKING terrorist. On the other hand, if a non-muslim asks for freedom ….
11.1.06 / 8pm
U said-”Because if Muslims kill muslims, its not terrorism”
Quran says that if a muslim fights a muslim it is not Jehad but if a muslim fights a non muslim it is Jehad.Same thing.
USA supports East timor etc etc not bcos it is a christian country but bcos it doesnot have any political advantages.
USA only believes in Economic advantage so it has nothing to do with east timor.Had it anything to do it wud have sent its troops.
Regarding Ghaznawi n Gauri..I want to undrstand why do u protest Iraq war..If u do..than do u agree that Ghaznawi n gauri were wrong too ???
11.3.06 / 12am
@abhishek
You said:Quran says that if a muslim fights a muslim it is not Jehad but if a muslim fights a non muslim it is Jehad.Same thing.
Point out a single verse in Quran where Quran says killing non muslim just because he is a non muslim is Jehad. Had it been like that, would our beloved Propthet, may peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, have give protection to christiants.
See: http://mirnazim.wordpress.com/2006/10/22/prophet-muhammads-letter-to-christians/
USA supports East timor etc etc not bcos it is a christian country but bcos it doesnot have any political advantages.
—
USA only believes in Economic advantage so it has nothing to do with east timor.Had it anything to do it wud have sent its troops.
i do not understand what you mean. I feel two sentences are contradicting. Can you expand on it a bit, please.
Regarding Ghaznawi n Gauri..I want to undrstand why do u protest Iraq war..If u do..than do u agree that Ghaznawi n gauri were wrong too ???
Gauri/Gaznawi and US war are different fought for different reasons in different times. How can these be compared. Moreover, all the rulers of that time were involved in similar wars to expand their empires. I do not understand how Gauri/Gaznawi are different. As you already said, US is not responsible for the safety of the captured people, how are Gauri and Gaznawi responsible for the saftey and well being of the people of the lands they captured. You seem to be confused
11.4.06 / 4pm
Nazim,Tell me how thety r different??
USA atrtacked Iraq for oil,which is very important to sustain its economy and is a major resource of modern times.
Ghaznawi and gauri attacked India for gold,silver which were the major resources of those times.
One attacked in the name of FIGHT AGAINST TERRORISM n another attacked in the name of SHOW THE PATH TO RIGHT RELIGION.
In both the wars innocent people get killed.
War has always been fought for capturing or looting resorces.Only the defination of resorce has changes.Earler it was gold/silver now it is liquid gold(Oil).
It should be understood that u have the right to condemn wat is happening now…but along the same time u must accept that muslims did it too…once upon a time.
Today muslims r on the backffoot..some centuries earlier some other community was too.
Condem both or condemn nothing.
11.5.06 / 1am
@abhishek
Yes they are different. Because in old times every one was doing it, in a small or big way.
Today, US is trying to act as a big daddy to all.
It is different my dear brother, you do not want to see the difference thats your problem.
You said: Condem both or condemn nothing.
Then You first have to condemn Prithivi Raj Chauhan, Raja Man Singh, author of Indian National Anthem for writing anti muslim books, and many other great kings of India. Then you have to condemn Indias support for Independence of Bangaladesh(remember Mukhti Bahini) and much more. Do it and i will reciprocate with the same
11.5.06 / 7pm
Ha Ha Ha .Another skipping of issue.Can u expalin how r the wars of today different from those days.Arent those fights were fought to capture resources ..just as now??
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